It makes me very happy to hear Michael is receiving public expressions of love for his wonderful TV shows. Parks and Rec., the Good Place, and a Man on the Inside have all helped cheer me up at moments that I needed it.
Jack Benny was about to perform on a Las Vegas showroom stage. He was in his mid-70s by then and, just offstage, looked it. He seemed like he could barely move. The showroom manager was going nuts. Benny's manager said, "Wait." The orchestra played the first note of his theme song, "Love in Bloom." Benny straightened up, shed 20 years, strolled out on stage, and knocked 'em dead.
HOFer for HOFer: 1926, Cards and Cubs trade Rogers Hornsby and Frankie Frisch. In addition to both being Hall of Fame bound, each also subsequently won an MVP award, and Frisch gets considerations in the great nicknames listings: Frankie Frisch the Fordham Flash.
Matt Olson as a HOF candidate? He had done enough so far that he has a chance, but is well short of the 'Hit by Bus' test. Solid, but not outstanding peak with some, but not much black ink (pixels?) on his bb-ref page. One season in the top five in MVP votes and the same season was top five in bWAR. So limited peak. I'd think he needs either an abnormally long healthy decline to get to some milestone numbers, or a couple of MVP type years or he'll be more Delgado or Teixeira than Bagwell or Helton.
As a Braves fan, I've been comparing his performance against Freeman's since the non-trade, trade. So far, Olson has a slim edge in bWAR, to 23.1 vs 21.8 over the course of their respective '22-'26 careers with similar in-season totals too. So far, Olson has been paid $102m by the Braves with another four years (through age 36 including his club option year) and $86m left on his deal. Freeman has received about 30% more at $135m plus one more season (age 37) at $27m left. And, of course, the Dodgers have Manfred's piece of metal times two, in no small part, because of some post-season star turns by Freemand.
Or, all in all, neither side is disappointed.
That said, I still dislike the move from my POV as an ATL fan. There is something special about a player being with a club throughout their career (e.g. Chipper) or nearly so (e.g. Murphy & Niekro). Plus, I really prefer Freeman's offensive profile to that of Olson.
Three of them were former or future Indians, and the other would go on to play a role in breaking Cleveland's heart. (To be fair, a LOT of people have played a role in breaking Cleveland's heart at one time or another.)
Got my copy yesterday (Barnes & Noble pre-order) and have read the foreword and first event. Hysterically funny (and not just Mike, but you, too, Joe).
I'm interested to read through the exploration of what fandom is and (at least as interesting) where it comes from. Wondering if you found anything like my story: as a Navy brat I was 10 before we settled permanently anywhere I could latch onto local teams. Also my father grew up in a place that didn't have any major sports teams at the time. So _where_ team attachments come from is something I find interesting.
I grew up in Indianapolis and nobody. My family was a sports fan at all. I still remember sitting in school and over the loudspeaker system at the end of the day one of the announcements was that the Chicago White Sox beat the Los Angeles Dodgers 11-0 in the first game of the World Series. I became a White Sox fan a rabbit fan from that point on. If the Dodgers had won that first game, I would’ve had a lot more good memories over the years.
Fast forward a couple years and I was sitting in front of the TV on a Sunday morning at some people’s house who were babysitting us while my parents were out of town. On came a football game between the Baltimore Colts and somebody I can’t remember. All I do remember is the announcer talking about the two time defending world champion Baltimore Colts being led by Johnny Unitas. And you can probably guess I became a huge Baltimore Colts fan. Decades later that transformed to be an Indianapolis Colts fan, my hometown team, although I had left in Indianapolis for good by then.
Mathewson for Rusie has to be one of the most lopsided trades in any sport. The Reds got 22 innings of Rusie (0-1, -0.7 WAR) and the Giants in return got almost 4800 innings from Mathewson (372 wins, 101 WAR). Interestingly, Matty finished his career back with the Reds, starting and completing one game, in which he gave up eight earned runs, but still got the W in a 10-8 victory over the Cubs (in that game Matty went 3 for 5 with a double, scoring and driving in a run).
Addendum from Baseball Reference: "Of course the trade was not entirely on the up-and-up: John T. Brush, the Giants owner, had devised a scheme to have Cincinnati draft Mathewson from his team, as he had a pre-arranged to then deal the washed-up Rusie to the Reds in order to get the young pitcher back."
Quibble: Brush, at the time, was the owner of the Reds. He was actively negotiating with Andrew Freedman, the then owner of the Giants, to purchase the latter club.
The trade was part of an odd - or frankly corrupt - series of actions. Matty was on the Giants but "bought" by the Reds for $100 (in something more akin to what we'd now call a Rule 5 draft) then immediately traded back from the Reds to the Giants. According to his SABR biography, the deal was designed to keep the Giants from having to pay Norfolk, the minor league club that had an interest in Matty, $1000. So the purchase by the Reds and trade for Rusie was just a sham to save the Giants $900.
And yes, there are the correct number of zeroes there. They schemed to save nine hundred dollars.
Not one for one, but thinking about other trades where each team acquired a future Hall of Famer. The Padres and Blue Jays swapped Fred McGriff+ for Roberto Alomar+. I'm sure there are plenty of others.
There are probably others, but the first one I thought of was Rogers Hornsby for Frankie Frisch, although it doesn't technically qualify, since a washed up pitcher named Jimmy Ring was also included.
Boy, how big of a jerk must Hornsby have been? After being traded from the Cardinals (where he once had a string of 6 consecutive years leading the league in BA, OBP, AND SLG) for Frisch, he promptly put up a 10-WAR season in 1927 for the Giants. Nevertheless, they just as promptly traded him to the Braves, where he had a 9 WAR season in 1928. Didn't stop the Braves from trading him to the Cubs, where he put up 11 WAR in 1929. Three years, 30 WAR, for 3 different teams. Apparently nothing was worth having Hornsby around.
Hornsby for Frisch is roughly similar to the Heinie Manush for Goose Goslin trade. A swap of two HOFers with one more body (General Crowder) added to the deal to keep it from being a true 1 for 1.
...
The only other pre Messersmith-McNally HOF with a trade history like that of Hornsby that I can think of is Dick Allen. The others who bounced around (eg. Rickey Henderson, Gaylord Perry, etc.) were after arbitrator Peter Seitz struck down the unending reserve clause.
Still trying to process how a man can make $356 million for hitting a ball with a stick, be a consensus Hall of Famer and immortal great in his sport, have an unexpected career resurgence to greatness at age 34, and have someone describe his situation as "sad."
One of my jobs is to help veterans apply for VA disability benefits. I met with a gentleman today living at a Veterans' Home who served 2 tours in Vietnam, 101st Airborne. After leaving the Army, he and his wife lived in Maine for over 50 years and raised a nice family. He was a meatcutter and worked hard, bought a house, saved money and was having a nice retirement. He just had a massive stroke. He's completely disabled and will never recover. And he'll likely lose all his savings and perhaps his house to pay for his care.
I'm sorry Joe, but Mike Trout can shove his "sad story" up his ass.
That's a terrible tragedy, but the comparison is utterly ridiculous. There's absolutely nothing wrong with a sportswriter talking about things that are sad within the context of sports.
He hasn't. Writers and fans do it for him, saying he "deserves" to be on a winner, which is poppycock.
Baseball is a team sport, and there are plenty of stars who never played for a champion. Trout, who was one of the greats, made his choice to stay with the Angels. He may have had reasons for it, and might even actually still be happy to be there.
But part of a fan's fantasy is for the golden boy to have some sort of great post season moment, and when a great player is on a bad team (and I think it is a bit more pronounced in today's world with 40% of the teams making the playoffs and players able to move around) and doesn't get to the post season, they have a tendency to feel cheated somehow, and sad that they wasted his talent or something. It is s childlike view at best.
I don't think that Trout's great career is any less because his team doesn't play in October.
It makes me very happy to hear Michael is receiving public expressions of love for his wonderful TV shows. Parks and Rec., the Good Place, and a Man on the Inside have all helped cheer me up at moments that I needed it.
Received my signed copy yesterday!
A girl in my high school named Blair married a man with the last name Blair. And took his last name.
Who is Becky Beck?
In honor of Buck O'Neil ....
Jack Benny was about to perform on a Las Vegas showroom stage. He was in his mid-70s by then and, just offstage, looked it. He seemed like he could barely move. The showroom manager was going nuts. Benny's manager said, "Wait." The orchestra played the first note of his theme song, "Love in Bloom." Benny straightened up, shed 20 years, strolled out on stage, and knocked 'em dead.
As Buck did.
Jason Kander needs to run for national public office. Not Missouri or Kansas representation but the Executive Branch. Could you suggest this, Joe?
From the Day 4 post, "I will tell you we have something special and maybe even a little bit touching to share with him (Jason) tonight."
So what was it you shared with him?
I am also wondering, and I was there! Either they missed it or I missed it- both plausible.
HOFer for HOFer: 1926, Cards and Cubs trade Rogers Hornsby and Frankie Frisch. In addition to both being Hall of Fame bound, each also subsequently won an MVP award, and Frisch gets considerations in the great nicknames listings: Frankie Frisch the Fordham Flash.
Matt Olson as a HOF candidate? He had done enough so far that he has a chance, but is well short of the 'Hit by Bus' test. Solid, but not outstanding peak with some, but not much black ink (pixels?) on his bb-ref page. One season in the top five in MVP votes and the same season was top five in bWAR. So limited peak. I'd think he needs either an abnormally long healthy decline to get to some milestone numbers, or a couple of MVP type years or he'll be more Delgado or Teixeira than Bagwell or Helton.
As a Braves fan, I've been comparing his performance against Freeman's since the non-trade, trade. So far, Olson has a slim edge in bWAR, to 23.1 vs 21.8 over the course of their respective '22-'26 careers with similar in-season totals too. So far, Olson has been paid $102m by the Braves with another four years (through age 36 including his club option year) and $86m left on his deal. Freeman has received about 30% more at $135m plus one more season (age 37) at $27m left. And, of course, the Dodgers have Manfred's piece of metal times two, in no small part, because of some post-season star turns by Freemand.
Or, all in all, neither side is disappointed.
That said, I still dislike the move from my POV as an ATL fan. There is something special about a player being with a club throughout their career (e.g. Chipper) or nearly so (e.g. Murphy & Niekro). Plus, I really prefer Freeman's offensive profile to that of Olson.
Olson would definitely not be a HOFer if he retired today. But he's 32, and he's still hitting pretty well, so he could get there.
how dare you!
One of the most interesting trades in decades - just putting a + truly diminishes this trade.
Fred McGriff and Tony Fernandez for Robbie Alomar and Joe Carter.
HOF for HOF and HOG (Hall of Great) for HOG.
I'd say Fernandez was Hall of Very Good, and Carter was Hall of Good. Without his WS homer, most people would have largely forgotten about him by now.
How dare you!
Three of them were former or future Indians, and the other would go on to play a role in breaking Cleveland's heart. (To be fair, a LOT of people have played a role in breaking Cleveland's heart at one time or another.)
Got my copy yesterday (Barnes & Noble pre-order) and have read the foreword and first event. Hysterically funny (and not just Mike, but you, too, Joe).
I'm interested to read through the exploration of what fandom is and (at least as interesting) where it comes from. Wondering if you found anything like my story: as a Navy brat I was 10 before we settled permanently anywhere I could latch onto local teams. Also my father grew up in a place that didn't have any major sports teams at the time. So _where_ team attachments come from is something I find interesting.
I grew up in Indianapolis and nobody. My family was a sports fan at all. I still remember sitting in school and over the loudspeaker system at the end of the day one of the announcements was that the Chicago White Sox beat the Los Angeles Dodgers 11-0 in the first game of the World Series. I became a White Sox fan a rabbit fan from that point on. If the Dodgers had won that first game, I would’ve had a lot more good memories over the years.
Fast forward a couple years and I was sitting in front of the TV on a Sunday morning at some people’s house who were babysitting us while my parents were out of town. On came a football game between the Baltimore Colts and somebody I can’t remember. All I do remember is the announcer talking about the two time defending world champion Baltimore Colts being led by Johnny Unitas. And you can probably guess I became a huge Baltimore Colts fan. Decades later that transformed to be an Indianapolis Colts fan, my hometown team, although I had left in Indianapolis for good by then.
My little story of fandom.
Love the story but it was hard to read in spots - "assisted" by a phone editor this time?
1:1 HOF trade from a mere 126 years ago. The Reds traded Christy Mathewson to the Giants for the desiccated husk of Amos Rusie.
Mathewson for Rusie has to be one of the most lopsided trades in any sport. The Reds got 22 innings of Rusie (0-1, -0.7 WAR) and the Giants in return got almost 4800 innings from Mathewson (372 wins, 101 WAR). Interestingly, Matty finished his career back with the Reds, starting and completing one game, in which he gave up eight earned runs, but still got the W in a 10-8 victory over the Cubs (in that game Matty went 3 for 5 with a double, scoring and driving in a run).
Addendum from Baseball Reference: "Of course the trade was not entirely on the up-and-up: John T. Brush, the Giants owner, had devised a scheme to have Cincinnati draft Mathewson from his team, as he had a pre-arranged to then deal the washed-up Rusie to the Reds in order to get the young pitcher back."
Quibble: Brush, at the time, was the owner of the Reds. He was actively negotiating with Andrew Freedman, the then owner of the Giants, to purchase the latter club.
The trade was part of an odd - or frankly corrupt - series of actions. Matty was on the Giants but "bought" by the Reds for $100 (in something more akin to what we'd now call a Rule 5 draft) then immediately traded back from the Reds to the Giants. According to his SABR biography, the deal was designed to keep the Giants from having to pay Norfolk, the minor league club that had an interest in Matty, $1000. So the purchase by the Reds and trade for Rusie was just a sham to save the Giants $900.
And yes, there are the correct number of zeroes there. They schemed to save nine hundred dollars.
Not one for one, but thinking about other trades where each team acquired a future Hall of Famer. The Padres and Blue Jays swapped Fred McGriff+ for Roberto Alomar+. I'm sure there are plenty of others.
Joe Torre for Orlando Cepeda
There are probably others, but the first one I thought of was Rogers Hornsby for Frankie Frisch, although it doesn't technically qualify, since a washed up pitcher named Jimmy Ring was also included.
Boy, how big of a jerk must Hornsby have been? After being traded from the Cardinals (where he once had a string of 6 consecutive years leading the league in BA, OBP, AND SLG) for Frisch, he promptly put up a 10-WAR season in 1927 for the Giants. Nevertheless, they just as promptly traded him to the Braves, where he had a 9 WAR season in 1928. Didn't stop the Braves from trading him to the Cubs, where he put up 11 WAR in 1929. Three years, 30 WAR, for 3 different teams. Apparently nothing was worth having Hornsby around.
Kinda sounds like Juan Soto
Or... staying on topic... sounds like James Harden
Hornsby for Frisch is roughly similar to the Heinie Manush for Goose Goslin trade. A swap of two HOFers with one more body (General Crowder) added to the deal to keep it from being a true 1 for 1.
...
The only other pre Messersmith-McNally HOF with a trade history like that of Hornsby that I can think of is Dick Allen. The others who bounced around (eg. Rickey Henderson, Gaylord Perry, etc.) were after arbitrator Peter Seitz struck down the unending reserve clause.
Still trying to process how a man can make $356 million for hitting a ball with a stick, be a consensus Hall of Famer and immortal great in his sport, have an unexpected career resurgence to greatness at age 34, and have someone describe his situation as "sad."
One of my jobs is to help veterans apply for VA disability benefits. I met with a gentleman today living at a Veterans' Home who served 2 tours in Vietnam, 101st Airborne. After leaving the Army, he and his wife lived in Maine for over 50 years and raised a nice family. He was a meatcutter and worked hard, bought a house, saved money and was having a nice retirement. He just had a massive stroke. He's completely disabled and will never recover. And he'll likely lose all his savings and perhaps his house to pay for his care.
I'm sorry Joe, but Mike Trout can shove his "sad story" up his ass.
I plead ignorance, but how in hell would his care not be covered by the VA?
That is an absolute outrage if ever I've heard one.
That's a terrible tragedy, but the comparison is utterly ridiculous. There's absolutely nothing wrong with a sportswriter talking about things that are sad within the context of sports.
What you've described isn't sad, it's a tragedy. A difference of scale.
I don’t recall Mike Trout ever claiming to have a sad story.
He hasn't. Writers and fans do it for him, saying he "deserves" to be on a winner, which is poppycock.
Baseball is a team sport, and there are plenty of stars who never played for a champion. Trout, who was one of the greats, made his choice to stay with the Angels. He may have had reasons for it, and might even actually still be happy to be there.
But part of a fan's fantasy is for the golden boy to have some sort of great post season moment, and when a great player is on a bad team (and I think it is a bit more pronounced in today's world with 40% of the teams making the playoffs and players able to move around) and doesn't get to the post season, they have a tendency to feel cheated somehow, and sad that they wasted his talent or something. It is s childlike view at best.
I don't think that Trout's great career is any less because his team doesn't play in October.
I appreciate your point of view even though I don't think I agree with much of it. But you get 100 points for using poppycock!